XWord Muggles Forum

I appreciate all the effort that goes into making these, and that we can do them for free.
But personally I feel the whole solving process should all be contained in the puzzle (grid, title, clues [hopefully not Only in the clues]), and not "you actually have to go somewhere else to find the solution". (I don't mean googling to help solve specific clues, we can't all know everything)

A number of recent puzzles were like that . Just sayin'
Although this time, I guess there is some warning.

Other than that I liked the puzzle.

2nd nudge did it for me. Would never have gotten there without at least the first - I perhaps was a bit impatient in opening the second. And now the title makes sense as well.

m5rammy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:15 pm I appreciate all the effort that goes into making these, and that we can do them for free.
But personally I feel the whole solving process should all be contained in the puzzle (grid, title, clues [hopefully not Only in the clues]), and not "you actually have to go somewhere else to find the solution". (I don't mean googling to help solve specific clues, we can't all know everything)

A number of recent puzzles were like that . Just sayin'
Although this time, I guess there is some warning.

Other than that I liked the puzzle.

Thanks m5rammy! Given your comment as well as Chris' I'd be interested to know what others think - do you guys prefer more "traditional" metas on "traditional" grids? If so I'll head more in that direction.

madhatter5 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:34 pm

m5rammy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:15 pm I appreciate all the effort that goes into making these, and that we can do them for free.
But personally I feel the whole solving process should all be contained in the puzzle (grid, title, clues [hopefully not Only in the clues]), and not "you actually have to go somewhere else to find the solution". (I don't mean googling to help solve specific clues, we can't all know everything)

A number of recent puzzles were like that . Just sayin'
Although this time, I guess there is some warning.

Other than that I liked the puzzle.

Thanks m5rammy! Given your comment as well as Chris' I'd be interested to know what others think - do you guys prefer more "traditional" metas on "traditional" grids? If so I'll head more in that direction.

I have to say I'm an American-style Crossword purist, with the commensurate rules, but as I mentioned in a Muggles Zoom meeting a couple weeks ago, I actually like that you're stretching/extending the rules a bit which allows for metas we couldn't have ever seen before. Who knows what would have happened if someone told the first person who came up with Cryptics "No, that's not the way we do things." Or for that matter, have you ever seen Arthur Wynne's first crossword? What if that format stuck?

madhatter5 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:34 pm Thanks m5rammy! Given your comment as well as Chris' I'd be interested to know what others think - do you guys prefer more "traditional" metas on "traditional" grids? If so I'll head more in that direction.

Well first I'll state I'm still in the litter box this week. The spoilers didn't tell me anything I didn't know, but I must not be applying it properly (and no worries! I may get to it later today for one last shot).

I made a few pathetic attempts to come up with my own meta a while ago, and that gave me an even greater appreciation for you folks who are talented enough to do it. So I'm delighted to look at whatever you serve up. Myself, I like the out-of-the-box grids and metas. Yeah, I may not solve all of them. But they are a breath of fresh air and stretch my brain. IMHO, save those rules for your submissions to the stuffy old NYT and WSJ.

^^^ This.

I may prefer classic grid rules metas on balance, and would welcome more, but we have plenty of those.

I agree that stretching the "rules" can sometimes be fun and refreshing.

I'm not fond of having to print grids in color unless it's essential. But if I'm told that color isn't essential for solving and that grey will do, I don't mind the color on screen.

Solution:

The long diagonal from NW to SE spells out a URL:

rb.gy/9ciwnm

This URL takes you to a Wikipedia page about the Western Black Widow (Latrodectus hesperus), which is the answer.

I mentioned this to Josh over email, but before re-examining the diagonal as prompted by the first nudge (initially I'd given up after seeing RBDOTGYSL...), I felt sure that the answer was going to be Orb-Weaver (spinner of the classic dreamcatcher spider web), because of how well it matches the title, and because WEBER (German for weaver) is in the grid.

It was nice to get to look at the wiki page for the Western Black Widow, though, because I had somehow been under the impression that they were much more dangerous than it seems that they in fact are. I'll breathe easier venturing into our crawl space.

madhatter5 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:34 pm

m5rammy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:15 pm I appreciate all the effort that goes into making these, and that we can do them for free.
But personally I feel the whole solving process should all be contained in the puzzle (grid, title, clues [hopefully not Only in the clues]), and not "you actually have to go somewhere else to find the solution". (I don't mean googling to help solve specific clues, we can't all know everything)

A number of recent puzzles were like that . Just sayin'
Although this time, I guess there is some warning.

Other than that I liked the puzzle.

Thanks m5rammy! Given your comment as well as Chris' I'd be interested to know what others think - do you guys prefer more "traditional" metas on "traditional" grids? If so I'll head more in that direction.

I am a relatively recent addition to meta-solving (started with the first WSJ meta), so I haven't been doing them long enough to be bored with the traditional sort, whatever that is. Even the most traditional of the traditionals sometimes give me an insurmountable challenge. I am always grateful to see a meta that uses a technique I've seen before (and am so proud that I've remembered it!).

However, I am reminded of successful musicians who become bored with their long-time hits, that all the world loves (and that's why it's a hit), so when they perform the long-time hits, they make some changes to the presentation. The musicians are artistically pleased, because they have changed things enough so that they are no longer bored. But, some in the audience are disappointed, and they say, "I came to hear the original hit, not this blankedy-blank mangled version."

So, a non-traditional meta will likely please the proficient solvers who want more of a challenge. And a traditional meta will please the rest of us who are still struggling with the basics. (I'd recommend a mix.)

I am not kicking myself for not getting this, although it would have broadened my arachnological knowledge. As it is, I have heard of only two kinds of spiders -- the black widow and the eensy weensy.

Had these as "pets" growing up - so was going to be my EWAG if I hadn't gloomed onto the proper solve.

madhatter5 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:34 pm Thanks m5rammy! Given your comment as well as Chris' I'd be interested to know what others think - do you guys prefer more "traditional" metas on "traditional" grids? If so I'll head more in that direction.

My own minor disappointment is that to solve the meta, I could have safely ignored 6 of the 9 enclosed areas. I originally thought I would be extracting a letter from each of the areas. I saw this puzzle as 9 separate and distinct mini-crosswords rather than 1 large one, so half-expected each mini puzzle to contribute to the solve.

I completely forgot to do this one at the normal time, but I finally just finished it (with the second hint) and it was really cool! Agree that's it's reminiscent of some PGW metas. I do prefer the traditional grid format, but mixing it up sometimes is fun too.

DNF for me this week, but I LOVE it.

Even before the spoilers, I noticed 37D DIAGONALS but unfortunately also locked onto 113D IS (iceland, in domain names) right beneath it. I got stuck on trying to parse domain name suffixes out of all the diagonal entries and even the spoilers didn't knock me out of that rut.

Kudos on a most brilliant puzzle!

One naive question from the not-so-tech savvy - are you able to control the web shortcuts you create at all? Or did you have to conform your diagonal to what was generated?

KayW wrote: ↑Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:35 am DNF for me this week, but I LOVE it.

Even before the spoilers, I noticed 37D DIAGONALS but unfortunately also locked onto 113D IS (iceland, in domain names) right beneath it. I got stuck on trying to parse domain name suffixes out of all the diagonal entries and even the spoilers didn't knock me out of that rut.

Kudos on a most brilliant puzzle!

One naive question from the not-so-tech savvy - are you able to control the web shortcuts you create at all? Or did you have to conform your diagonal to what was generated?

Thanks Kay! No, unfortunately I had no control over the URL that came out of the shortcutter (probably someone savvier than I am would have, though). So I had to fit the diagonal to what was generated, which involved a lot of trial and error with a lot of wiki pages on different spider species. But it was a lot of fun to make this grid.

Fun fact: I initially wanted to use a spider grid for the Black History Month puzzle I co-constructed with Al, with the answer being W.E.B. Du Bois. But it didn't really work and we decided on Hidden Figures, which was a far better idea (of Al's).

I've done quite a few animals now, but strangely enough, still no cats.

This may partly spoil a recent puzzle some may still be working on, though its solution has already been posted.

A recent puzzle relied on being able to customize a URL at a different service, namely, tinyurl.com. It was Malaika Handa's puzzle, which is available, now with solution, here: https://www.7xwords.com/all/i-fold.html

I haven’t been solving meta crosswords for long, but here’s my take:

If I print out a crossword puzzle (meta or not) and hand it to you to solve, you ostensibly have everything you need to solve that puzzle (maybe I’ll even hand you a pencil ).

To solve this World Wide Web puzzle and others like it, you CANNOT solve it unless you have access to the internet.

I don’t know if a disclaimer is appropriate or call it a different kind of puzzle (“extracross” or “outrocross” puzzle?). It’s more like a step on a puzzle hunt than a standalone puzzle.

Those are my thoughts.

Allison (Alvibu67)