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Re: "I Can See Clearly Now"
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2024 7:33 pm
by miked
Thanks
@Cap'n Rick - the descriptions you gave for the different statistics are better than I could've done myself
![Smile :)](./images/smilies/icon_e_smile.gif)
. I probably should add some descriptions to those stats pages, actually.
If anybody has ideas for other statistics that we could add for constructors definitely don't be shy to make suggestions!
Cheers,
Mike
Re: "I Can See Clearly Now"
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 8:37 am
by CPJohnson
Cap'n Rick wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2024 3:25 pm
Anita wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2024 1:05 pm
Interesting stats at the end there - especially about audience size. I assume "without helpers" means pre-hints. But folks may have helped each other. I'm starting to see lots of posts where someone took a nudge immediately on the first day.
Thanks for your comments, @Anita.
First, I think a little background info on Crosshare might help you and others better understand the statistics. In addition to being an awesome crossword/meta construction tool, Crosshare is also a community of both constructors (some meta, but mostly not) and solvers. There is some overlap with our Muggle community, but I'm not sure how much. They "seem" to be a relatively younger group of people, but again, I'm not exactly sure. They feature a variety of puzzle types on their site each day (5x5 minis, 11x11 midis, and 15x15 themed, themeless, and meta, etc.). I've been trying to interpret the Crosshare stats vis-a-vis our Muggle meta puzzles for a while now, and here's my quick summary of the parameters and my interpretations:
- Total completions: Total number of people who completed the grid only (not the meta)
- Average completion time: Average time to complete the grid only
- Completions without helpers: Total number of people who completed the grid only without checking or revealing any squares, words, or the puzzle itself
- Average time without helpers: Average time to complete the grid only without revealing any squares, words, or the puzzle
- Correct contest submissions: Number of correct meta answer submissions
- Total contest submissions: Total number of meta answer submissions
Interestingly, these stats have been pretty consistent (for me, at least) from puzzle to puzzle. The number of grid "Completions without helpers" is usually about half the number of "Total completions". "Average completion time" usually runs around 10 minutes, and "Average time without helpers" is usually between 8-10 minutes. "Total contest submissions" (for meta answers) usually end up averaging between 1/3 and 1/2 of "Total completions" (for the grid), which is interesting because there are a lot of solvers out there (mostly from the Crosshare community, I'm guessing) who only complete the grid without submitting answers to the metas. "Correct contest submissions" usually averages between 85%-95% of "Total contest submissions".
As most Muggles already know, Crosshare allows multiple submissions of meta answers, and it will instantly indicate when a correct meta answer is submitted (a very handy feature for both solvers and constructors!). At publishing time, Crosshare constructors can set an option that prevents solvers from being able to reveal meta answers for 7 days. I virtually always set this option, so the only early help that solvers receive is either from me directly or from their solving friends.
I'm "copying" @miked who manages Crosshare, and I'd ask him to please correct me if any of my definitions and/or interpretations are incorrect. He can also offer up his descriptions and/or views of the Crosshare and Muggle communities if he'd like.
I hope some of my ramblings above helped to clarify a few things for you, @Anita.
Cap'n Rick
I'm not sure how valuable the Average Completion time is. I always print the puzzles and solve on paper. Then, to enter my meta answer in Crosshare, I click on Reveal Puzzle, so the time in Crosshare is a few seconds, not the actual time it took for me to complete the grid.
Re: "I Can See Clearly Now"
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 8:55 am
by boharr
I do something similar. I solve on a puz file. When I'm ready to submit, I go to Crosshare. I immediately hit reveal and submit. So I'm only on Crosshare for a very short time even if I am correct and leave a comment.
Re: "I Can See Clearly Now"
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:09 am
by Cap'n Rick
Thank you, @CPJohnson and @boharr. Yes, this information only applies to Crosshare users and not to folks who solve on paper and then check meta answers via Crosshare. (I, too, do that sometimes.) Many people do complete the grid online via Crosshare; however, and for these individuals I look at "Average time without helpers" (i.e. without revealing any squares, words, or the puzzle itself) as a relative indication of grid difficulty. I try to keep my grids on the less-difficult side so that folks can spend more time solving the metas.
Re: "I Can See Clearly Now"
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:18 am
by boharr
"I try to keep my grids on the less-difficult side so that folks can spend more time solving the metas."
Much appreciated @Cap'n Rick and a keen insight for constructors.
Re: "I Can See Clearly Now"
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:59 am
by CPJohnson
boharr wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:18 am
"I try to keep my grids on the less-difficult side so that folks can spend more time solving the metas."
Much appreciated @Cap'n Rick and a keen insight for constructors.
A keen insight, indeed. I once asked a constructor if he created puzzles with other constructors in mind, or with "the rest of us" in mind. His reply was, "of course, other constructors."
![Shocked :shock:](./images/smilies/icon_eek.gif)
If meta puzzles are created with the idea of impressing other constructors, how do creators expect to increase their audience size? I guess the answer is.....their goal is not to increase audience size; it is to get rave reviews from other constructors.
@boharr @Cap'n Rick